The Irish slave trade

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The Irish slave trade

Postby Fiction & Falsehood » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:03 am

http://www.minds.com/blog/view/47549/th ... %9D-slaves
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They came as slaves; vast human cargo transported on tall British ships bound for the Americas. They were shipped by the hundreds of thousands and included men, women, and even the youngest of children.

Whenever they rebelled or even disobeyed an order, they were punished in the harshest ways. Slave owners would hang their human property by their hands and set their hands or feet on fire as one form of punishment. They were burned alive and had their heads placed on pikes in the marketplace as a warning to other captives.

We don’t really need to go through all of the gory details, do we? We know all too well the atrocities of the African slave trade.

But, are we talking about African slavery? King James II and Charles I also led a continued effort to enslave the Irish. Britain’s famed Oliver Cromwell furthered this practice of dehumanizing one’s next door neighbor.

The Irish slave trade began when James II sold 30,000 Irish prisoners as slaves to the New World. His Proclamation of 1625 required Irish political prisoners be sent overseas and sold to English settlers in the West Indies. By the mid 1600s, the Irish were the main slaves sold to Antigua and Montserrat. At that time, 70% of the total population of Montserrat were Irish slaves.

Ireland quickly became the biggest source of human livestock for English merchants. The majority of the early slaves to the New World were actually white.

From 1641 to 1652, over 500,000 Irish were killed by the English and another 300,000 were sold as slaves. Ireland’s population fell from about 1,500,000 to 600,000 in one single decade. Families were ripped apart as the British did not allow Irish dads to take their wives and children with them across the Atlantic. This led to a helpless population of homeless women and children. Britain’s solution was to auction them off as well.

During the 1650s, over 100,000 Irish children between the ages of 10 and 14 were taken from their parents and sold as slaves in the West Indies, Virginia and New England. In this decade, 52,000 Irish (mostly women and children) were sold to Barbados and Virginia. Another 30,000 Irish men and women were also transported and sold to the highest bidder. In 1656, Cromwell ordered that 2000 Irish children be taken to Jamaica and sold as slaves to English settlers.

Many people today will avoid calling the Irish slaves what they truly were: Slaves. They’ll come up with terms like “Indentured Servants” to describe what occurred to the Irish. However, in most cases from the 17th and 18th centuries, Irish slaves were nothing more than human cattle.

As an example, the African slave trade was just beginning during this same period. It is well recorded that African slaves, not tainted with the stain of the hated Catholic theology and more expensive to purchase, were often treated far better than their Irish counterparts.

African slaves were very expensive during the late 1600s (50 Sterling). Irish slaves came cheap (no more than 5 Sterling). If a planter whipped or branded or beat an Irish slave to death, it was never a crime. A death was a monetary setback, but far cheaper than killing a more expensive African. The English masters quickly began breeding the Irish women for both their own personal pleasure and for greater profit. Children of slaves were themselves slaves, which increased the size of the master’s free workforce. Even if an Irish woman somehow obtained her freedom, her kids would remain slaves of her master. Thus, Irish moms, even with this new found emancipation, would seldom abandon their kids and would remain in servitude.

In time, the English thought of a better way to use these women (in many cases, girls as young as 12) to increase their market share: The settlers began to breed Irish women and girls with African men to produce slaves with a distinct complexion. These new “mulatto” slaves brought a higher price than Irish livestock and, likewise, enabled the settlers to save money rather than purchase new African slaves. This practice of interbreeding Irish females with African men went on for several decades and was so widespread that, in 1681, legislation was passed “forbidding the practice of mating Irish slave women to African slave men for the purpose of producing slaves for sale.” In short, it was stopped only because it interfered with the profits of a large slave transport company.

England continued to ship tens of thousands of Irish slaves for more than a century. Records state that, after the 1798 Irish Rebellion, thousands of Irish slaves were sold to both America and Australia. There were horrible abuses of both African and Irish captives. One British ship even dumped 1,302 slaves into the Atlantic Ocean so that the crew would have plenty of food to eat.

There is little question that the Irish experienced the horrors of slavery as much (if not more in the 17th Century) as the Africans did. There is, also, very little question that those brown, tanned faces you witness in your travels to the West Indies are very likely a combination of African and Irish ancestry. In 1839, Britain finally decided on it’s own to end it’s participation in Satan’s highway to hell and stopped transporting slaves. While their decision did not stop pirates from doing what they desired, the new law slowly concluded THIS chapter of nightmarish Irish misery.

But, if anyone, black or white, believes that slavery was only an African experience, then they’ve got it completely wrong.

Irish slavery is a subject worth remembering, not erasing from our memories.

But, where are our public (and PRIVATE) schools???? Where are the history books? Why is it so seldom discussed?

Do the memories of hundreds of thousands of Irish victims merit more than a mention from an unknown writer?

Or is their story to be one that their English pirates intended: To (unlike the African book) have the Irish story utterly and completely disappear as if it never happened.

None of the Irish victims ever made it back to their homeland to describe their ordeal. These are the lost slaves; the ones that time and biased history books conveniently forgot.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Red_switch » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:08 am

My Grandfather was Irish (but not a leprechaun).
I think it's lint.

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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Fiction & Falsehood » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:18 am

please try not to make this about a mythical oppression by blacks/jews/maoris/asians of whites, white isnt a race, to me this underlines that fact.

by being right wing youre pretty much in support of the people that did this
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Skoll » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:36 am

Fiction & Falsehood wrote:by being right wing youre pretty much in support of the people that did this


That's like saying people who are left wing support what Stalin did...

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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Fiction & Falsehood » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:56 am

i suppose it is, so?
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby crain » Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:55 pm

Waste of time, they're the worst fucking workers money can buy. No wonder their economy is fucked.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Fiction & Falsehood » Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:16 am

nazi scum wrote:So you are wrong

Fiction & Falsehood wrote:by being right wing youre pretty much in support of the people that did this


Fool

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery

Slavery was known in almost every ancient civilization, and society, including Sumer, Ancient Egypt, Ancient China, the Akkadian Empire, Assyria, Ancient India, Ancient Greece, the Roman Empire, the Islamic Caliphate, the Hebrews in Palestine, and the pre-Columbian civilizations of the Americas. Such institutions included debt-slavery, punishment for crime, the enslavement of prisoners of war, child abandonment, and the birth of slave children to slaves.

One of the most significant milestones in the campaign to abolish slavery throughout the world occurred in England in 1772...

The "people that did this" were the first in the world to try and stop it.


well it wasnt the rightwing of the day that protested the ill treatment of their fellow man.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Tartanperil » Fri Mar 29, 2013 3:16 pm

Wait, so how much did the Nazis pay the Jews they put to work in work-camps?

Minimum?

Less that minimum?

Oh wait, nothing and they took all their possessions. Sounds a bit like slavery to me.




Pretty sure you'll find it was largely the progressive movements that became the left which started the end of slavery, with the conservative/pro-big-business/etc that became the right trying to keep it.

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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby akaxo » Fri Mar 29, 2013 5:14 pm

and all the property that was taken from them was stolen in the first place.

would be keen on reading that book, know nothing about it.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Fiction & Falsehood » Fri Mar 29, 2013 7:08 pm

theres another really good book called white gold which is about slaves taken from england and wales mainly, but also france, ireland and scotland, for sale in morocco
its the story of a cornish guy who eventually escaped and made it back home to tell his tale.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Tartanperil » Fri Mar 29, 2013 7:34 pm

St Patrick was a Welsh peasant abducted by slave traders and taken/sold to Ireland iirc.

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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Fiction & Falsehood » Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:06 pm

yeh but like darren youre missing the point, thats not unknown or unusual for its time, the point of the two books mentioned is that they were concurrent with african slavery, its generally perceived that only black people were slaves in that time, especially in america.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby FC » Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:41 pm

I guess the reason that african slavery is talked about so much more often than european slavery is sheer numbers. It was a few hundred thousand irish as opposed to 15-20 million africans. It's probably the same reason they don't talk about a lot of the other slave trades so much. It should be talked about within the areas that it happened for sure, but it's understandable that it's not so widely known (though it doesn't make it any less horrific).
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Fiction & Falsehood » Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:43 pm

nah that cant be right.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby FC » Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:48 pm

Then I guess everyone just super cares about black people and hates the irish.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Fiction & Falsehood » Sat Mar 30, 2013 9:50 am

haha, thats about the shape of it.

nah i just couldnt be bothered replying properly last night, it might be a smaller number if you just divide it in a racist white/black way, but the african slaves were taken from a much wider area, many countries were affected, not one supercountry called 'africa'

i was gunna go on about the sheer numbers of people from britain and europe taken into slavery, in the arab world, but i thought id let you read it yourself.
After a revolt in the mid-17th century reduced the ruling Ottoman Pashas to little more than figureheads in the region, the towns of Tripoli, Algiers, Tunis and others became independent in all but name. Without a large central authority and its laws, the pirates themselves started to gain much influence. Pirate raids for the acquisition of slaves occurred in towns and villages on the African Atlantic seaboard, as well as in Europe. Reports of Barbary raids and kidnappings of those in Italy, Spain, France, Portugal, England, Ireland, Scotland as far north as Iceland exist from between the 16th to the 19th centuries. It is estimated that between 1 million and 1.25 million Europeans were captured by pirates and sold as slaves during this time period.[2] Famous accounts of Barbary slave raids include a mention in the Diary of Samuel Pepys and a raid on the coastal village of Baltimore, Ireland, during which pirates left with the entire populace of the settlement. Such raids in the Mediterrean were so frequent and devastating that the coastline between Venice to Malaga[3] suffered widespread depopulation, and settlement there was discouraged. In fact, it was said that this was largely because 'there was no one left to capture any longer'.[4] The power and influence of these pirates during this time was such that nations including the United States of America paid tribute in order to stave off their attacks.[5]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbary_sl ... ry_slavery
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_slave ... _the_trade
sure the numbers dont really compare, but that being the reason for the relative silence just doesnt seem to ring true

the reason its been overlooked by history is that england in particular, the author of most of our history, didnt like to admit that its citizens could be enslaved, it didnt fit with the self image of the country, and especially in modern times when irish people are considered people, they dont like to be reminded of things that cant be written off as simple excesses of war.
i doubt america particularly liked to acknowledge these facts either, enslaving white people just fucks up their whole ideal of the land of the free(i know, i know,i know, blacks, asians and native americans)it was only about a hundred years after the irish slave trade ended that irish people took a leading role in shaping the country.

nowadays, these stories are coming out, and i guess some people like to think its a racial motive in exposing this, but our perfect example nazi scum seemed to want to brush it off, i dont hear hatye groups trumpeting this stuff, the book about thomas pellow is 10 years old.

A while back i picked up and read this very interesting book on the white slave trade which took place mostly between the late 1500's & early 1700's, where over a million white people were captured and sold into a slave trade run by Muslims.
The book is mostly based on the true accounts by a man called Thomas Pellow, who was captured at sea by muslim slave traders and spent the next 30+ years of his life in slavery under the tyrant sultan of Morroco Moulay Ismail.

White Gold: The Forgotten Story of North Africa's One Million European Slaves (by Giles Milton);

http://www.amazon.co.uk/White-Gold-Extr ... 0340794704

Before i read this book i had never ever heard of the existence of a white slave trade, let alone of an era where many European countries (primarily Spain, Britain & France etc) were persecuted for generations by muslim pirates who emptied entire villages of their populations at a time on a regular basis.
And the book also offers great insight into why there was a demand for white slaves and the slave culture of Morocco at the time. It also gives insight into Morocco's black slave trade too, and the terrible realities of Moulay Ismails regime, his countless palaces, the politics of the day, his concubines, his family, his enemies and our desperate attempts to end the white slave trade. For the most part, we were actually on the weak/loosing side and could do almost nothing by stand by as our coasts were brutally & regularly raided of our people.

And the book also goes onto explain that it was eventually our experiences of the white slave trade that eventually helped people to support the end of the black slave trade (although unfortunately for a long time despite the great similarities, people did viewed both trades as entirely different matters for a long time).

There is no doubt that the black slave trade was far greater in scale (15million black africans in comparison to only a 1million white europeans), but i am surprised this incident in history is so little talked about. I never knew about it before i read this book and most people i have talked to so far have never heard about a white slave trade either- have you?
I wonder why this era in history is not talked about in History lessons in school, as it certainly wasn't in mine. A lot of people go on about the cruasades, but this incident is of far more recent historical relevance, yet no one talks about it?
I guess it might be because although it happened a long time ago, the horrors that people endured throughout the white slave trade might still be enough to induce bad feelings towards muslims, and so the government conviniently leaves it out of the school curriculum maybe? A tricky subject. (btw the i am not anti-muslim or anything like that)


http://www.gilesmilton.com/white-gold

'Lovinge and kind father and mother... I am here in Salley [a Moroccan port] in most miserable captivitye, under the hands of most cruell tyrants... [I] worke at a mill like a horse, from morninge untill night, with chaines uppon my legges, of 36 pounds waights a peece.' - a letter from English slave, Robert Adams, circa 1620.


Giles Milton wrote:Records are divided into subject areas but these are often poorly indexed and there is little clue as to what is in each box. But I found one crate of state papers that contained a wealth of information about Thomas Pellow and his crew: it included fascinating correspondence, petitions and consuls' reports.It was never taught at school and there is very little written on the subject - a surprising omission given the wealth of source material.
There are many early printed records of the conditions of the white slaves of North Africa, most of which are written by eyewitnesses - padres and ambassadors who were sent to try to redeem the men in captivity. Many of these accounts are written and published in French.

There are also accounts written by slaves themselves: one surprising discovery was a manuscript diary kept by a captive named John Whitehead. (Pictured above) It would be good to think that one day this will be published.

I discovered one most intriguing account written by a female slave in Barbary - a Dutch woman named Maria. The 1748 Dutch edition of her work is no longer extant but I have a French edition of the book.

I have a long-term project to translate her work and publish it in English.


the reasons for it being ignored are much more complex, i think perhaps a part of it is there is no descendants of white slaves aware of their history, our society being the judgmental bunch of fuckwits that it is, for a long time people would have tended to keep that fact secret, quite quickly forgetting it altogether, and they are not visible like people of african origin, even in islamic countries, a white skinned person will blend in quite quickly, tho of course in the nomadic tribes of north africa there is plenty of evidence of european origin, thats why they followed a wild goose chase searching for madeline mccain there.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby akaxo » Sat Mar 30, 2013 9:58 am

one interesting thing i've learnt because of this thread is that white cargo is the name of felicity kendal's memoirs.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby FC » Sat Mar 30, 2013 10:56 am

Yeah I had a good read of a lot of stuff last night, most of which I wasn't aware of (especially the barbary pirates). Seems a lot of europeans wound up in galleys until they dropped dead.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Fiction & Falsehood » Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:30 am

From approximately 650 until around the 1960s, the Arab slave trade continued in one form or another. Historical accounts and references to slave-owning nobility in Arabia, Yemen and elsewhere are frequent into the early 1920s.[33] In 1953, sheikhs from Qatar attending the coronation of Queen Elizabeth II included slaves in their retinues, and they did so again on another visit five years later.[34]

i doubt the slaves in this case would have been english, or even 'white' that would just be poor manners.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby buckton » Thu Apr 04, 2013 2:32 am

nazi scum wrote:So I asked the bankers at the Foreign Exchange what the rate was and if I had a nice Asian family whether I could get a nice blonde Norwegian lass to exchange they said it didnt quite work that way...


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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby dustbinflowers » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:34 am

The Pacific slave trade. Several big NZ shipping companies were involved.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackbirding
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Little Miss Twoshoes » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:46 am

Christ, that slavery portal is fucking depressing. Humanity's been fux0red for aaaaaages.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Philfy Vermin » Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:24 am

yeh, lets not pretend it doesnt happen today, certainly sex slavery is alive and well.

i knew about blackbirding, read some pretty horrific accounts where a ship would pull up, fire on the village from offshore with a big cannon that fired shrapnel, tearing right thru the houses and fucking everyone up, then they would go an collect the survivors.
but id never heard about the irish slave trade, and thats whats so perplexing about it, why has it been so obscure for so long?
i knew about 'indentured labour' but i had assumed that freedom could be earned, and that they had rights as human beings.
Last edited by Philfy Vermin on Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby FC » Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:26 am

There's still a few african countries that have a lot of slavery, most of it tolerated by authorities, I think Mali is a pretty bad offender if I remember correctly.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Philfy Vermin » Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:28 am

yeh, apparently almost all cocoa for our chocolate is produced by child slaves, as the market is so weak its the only way to operate.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby dustbinflowers » Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:32 am

And most of the Central American gem trade. I got banned from Christopher's Crystals on Cuba St a meelion years ago because I asked him if the giant Amethyst crystal in his shop which gives enough good energy for all of Wellington also gave good energy to the child slaves who dug it up...
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby General Mutante » Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:19 pm

Anyone who has a shop called Christopher's Crystals is automatically a cunt anyway.
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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby Philfy Vermin » Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:21 pm

nomie gave me a crystal she had filled with good energy for me, i didnt wanna tell her it didnt really make up for ...all of the things.
Hail to the demons of the earth and kaos anarchy and destruction to those who exploit our human rights and starve the poor and make us suffer for the dead now walk the earth the armys of the dead hail vampires and all creatures of the night hail to the white moon and drtink the blood of our enimies and paint the town red


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Re: The Irish slave trade

Postby General Mutante » Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:25 am

She was a fucking mental.
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