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The Ost
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Postby The Ost » Wed Apr 09, 2003 10:40 am

Matt wrote:I still feel there is a disconnect between the 80s bands and those that rose out of the mid-90s...it's hard to spot a direct lineage of influence there. I bring that up because the optimist in me likes to dream that NZ's punk glory days are still ahead of us.



No Matt, it is possible to connect the bands together.

This is a hypothetical way of looking at it, but:
Scavengers play --- guys go along, get inspired, form Dum Dum Boys
---> DDBoys play, guys go along, get inspired, form No Idea (yeah mixing my AK and Welly bands who cares?)
No Idea play ---> guys get inspired form Salad Daze
Salad Daze disband ----> form Balance
Balance play ----> guys go along get inspired, form a pile of bands
People from Balance leave, form new bands incl Sommerset
and so on.

you only have to talk to people to find out there influences locally. It all connects, the only problem is that there have been several waves where a lot of people have dropped out and left the scene. But the people that have stayed through are proof that there is a semblance of continuity there, albeit a fraction of what it should be.
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Postby mike » Wed Apr 09, 2003 11:54 am

Well when you think about it Stefan came from the 80's(sommerset bass player) he used to play in that Ak band Migraine and I do remember him coming from Tauranga and doing a fanzine and a band there.Also Balance were going for a very long time before they ended up in there Hardcore state.At one stage they even had the singer from Bygone Era before that guy Mike took over again.Another band that was a big factor was the Psychodaisies lead by John Baker (sure more of a garagey punk band) but they toured the length of the country and then inspired Nothing At All and all that frisbee stuff which lead to D4.When you talk about NZ bands playing to thousands of people Reptiles At Dawn who were before that known as the Henchmen and the Dum Dum Boys at one stage they had a song that did very well in the American colledge radio circuit it could of even been number 1,ask someone like Brain Wafer.

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Re: Warners

Postby Maleficent » Wed Apr 09, 2003 12:37 pm

Matt wrote:... the optimist in me likes to dream that NZ's punk glory days are still ahead of us.


To be honest Matt, I reckon its better to think that they never stopped.
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Postby Prince Of The Rodeo » Wed Apr 09, 2003 11:42 pm

Shut up you silly moo Chris Knox is a wanker.
And I sent your stuff.

Flesh D-Vice as Sommerset.

No, it was different.

Or maybe it was the same.

Anyway, JUST SHUT UP. :twisted:
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Postby switch_blade » Wed Apr 09, 2003 11:47 pm

shades wrote:
girl_geek wrote:
Militia / Misadventures in Self Surgery - they will be - just give them time.
To be influental you need to break the mould as these 2 bands are doing.

Ummm, End.


totally umm... neither of those are punk bands


yep - am fully aware of this...

I guess the thread asked for PUNK specifically BUT in saying that I think that we will hear more of the Math Metal / Grindcore coming out of New Zealand that these bands are doing (one can only hope)... probably metal bands but hey it may travel into punk - the 2 genres can be quite friendly at times.
I'm sorry if I offended anyone by not posting this explanation with my first post.
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Postby Ace McWicked » Thu Apr 10, 2003 4:56 pm

Just out of curiousity, how is this thread DOING ANYTHING that most of the other threads aren't?

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The Ost
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Postby The Ost » Thu Apr 10, 2003 5:35 pm

DZ wrote:Just out of curiousity, how is this thread DOING ANYTHING that most of the other threads aren't?


Okay

number one: you're three days out of context

number two: i'm trying to provoke intelligent discussion and debate about PUNK music, the point of this message board to some big degree.

number three: thanks for adding nothing to this otherwise worthwhile thread. but, I hope you might have learnt something about the history of NZ punk music.
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Postby Maleficent » Fri Apr 11, 2003 11:21 am

Prince Of The Rodeo wrote:Shut up you silly moo Chris Knox is a wanker.
And I sent your stuff.

Flesh D-Vice as Sommerset.

No, it was different.

Or maybe it was the same.

Anyway, JUST SHUT UP. :twisted:


Chris Knox is a sweetie. Yay! I get stuff soon.
I have no time left to upload the new site - oh well.
Have you been listening to Kelly Osbourne?
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Postby >>>>>>& » Sun Apr 13, 2003 10:56 am

kelly osbourne = the new Brody armstrong
i am of the mind and the opinion that if something doesn't accept you,
you do everything in your power to fucking destroy it.
i don't care if it's the world, society, your family or a fucking high school
keg party.
you do everything you can to hit back...and strike back.
let go of some of that fucking hatred
i wanna poison this world the way it fuckin poisoned me.
i'm gonna to everthing, EVERYTHING in my power to corrupt, to twist, to
destroy, to rip apart, to poison.
i'm gonna spit my last breath in all your faces.
you're gonna hear me laughin at the end.

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Postby Ace McWicked » Mon Apr 14, 2003 3:45 pm

The 'Ost wrote:
DZ wrote:Just out of curiousity, how is this thread DOING ANYTHING that most of the other threads aren't?


Okay

number one: you're three days out of context

number two: i'm trying to provoke intelligent discussion and debate about PUNK music, the point of this message board to some big degree.

number three: thanks for adding nothing to this otherwise worthwhile thread. but, I hope you might have learnt something about the history of NZ punk music.


I stand errected...

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Missing links

Postby Nickee » Tue Jun 03, 2003 7:55 pm

There is a big missing link from bands in the 80's to now- things were different, more political, more violence in the scene- I remember the golden showers in wellington, It was ak versus wellington- whos the toughest-the music was forgotten a lot of the time- I dont see many bands now but there were some great ones and great, if a little too violent gigs down here- The Manson Family, FDV, Steroids for a while, The Warners gigs were always great, they seemed to bring new bands down with them from ak, like Bygone era, Salad days etc, I went up to AK once and they even put shihad on a bill for there first gig out of wellington, The Manson Family were great- skate boarding skins! The bands now dont seem to be as real as these ones- they lived the life , sung about it, and meant it. I dont think apart from FDV who werent that good really anyway that any punks now would even know who these bands are.

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Postby sweet cuz » Tue Jun 03, 2003 8:19 pm

good to see some PUNK music being debated on the PUNK board.
hey its even new zealand, funnily enough, seeing as how this is punkas- the best of NEW ZEALAND punk, ska and hc.

why is HC in a different league than punk?

im not really qualified to say NZ's best punk band, ive only been "into it" for a few years but the best band ive seen play (also pretty much the only band ive seen play :wink: ) is sommerset.
pretty good live show, better than the datsuns who are supposedly the "hottest live act on the planet"

on a side note, as anyone seen in the new blindspott vid, ithink its.... phlex.. theres a scene in the tat. parlor, and they have a whole lot of punk show posters... missing teeth, sommerset, flesh d-vice, thats all i could see, but humdidlyhum.

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Postby slaughter » Tue Jun 03, 2003 8:21 pm

2 hugely important punk bands of NZ.

ALL LEFT OUT and PUGFACE

coz their easy to listen to, have nice hooks in their songs, dont get all drunk all the time and swear, and they have the true spirit of punk in themselves.

same as Mumsdollar.
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Postby PertHJ » Tue Jun 03, 2003 8:59 pm

i think I would prefer this more non violent scene by the sounds, but im a bit of a nana.

The bands now dont seem to be as real as these ones- they lived the life , sung about it, and meant it.


maybe this is true or maybe you are just remembering "the good old days".

admitidly Ive never heard of any of those bands, but when im old will people remember bonus doner, hung jury, if i had a gun, the carnys, the rudies, missing teeth, granny pash this, night creeps, etc etc etc?

man how very depressing
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Postby phaedrus » Wed Jun 04, 2003 1:19 am

imthepie wrote:why is HC in a different league than punk?


I guess it is just a different feel... I personally still consider HC very much a part of my broader definition of punk, but I am happy to say I saw this punk band or I saw this HC band when talking about them...

imthepie wrote:on a side note, as anyone seen in the new blindspott vid, ithink its.... phlex.. theres a scene in the tat. parlor, and they have a whole lot of punk show posters... missing teeth, sommerset, flesh d-vice, thats all i could see, but humdidlyhum.


If it were in a tat parlour it would hacve been sacred... but I didn't pay that much attention... the majority of the vid was filmed in a flat down the road, like 100 metres away from tattoo sacred... so if any of ya missed Evil Priest (with DanWolf on bass) because you didn't know the mystery location, then that's it... now starring on RTR in a Blindspott vid...

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Postby The Ost » Wed Jun 04, 2003 9:50 am

Slaughter wrote:coz their easy to listen to, have nice hooks in their songs, dont get all drunk all the time and swear, and they have the true spirit of punk in themselves.


Hmmm that sentence manages to contradict itself in just about every way possible....

Punk eh?
:roll:

Nickee, interesting to read your thoughts. Yes, I guess to a large degree the political side of bands these days if often under-developed or ignored completely, however one only has to look at the political discussions on this board to garner some insights into why this occurs.

Firstly, people can be a lot better informed about what's happening in the world these days, so a band doesn't necessarily have the same sort of "responsibility" as it were to convey and inform its audience on political situations.

Secondly, although early punk did have some political themes, the really political stuff didn't really come into effect until 79/80. However, this is still 23 years of political diatribes and anthems. Really, a lot of the issues have been addressed with in a musical form - in a sense, the people that go to shows have heard it. It's a case of preaching to the converted - and not only that, but could we do a better job than what has been done? I personally would find it difficult to better anything Conflict wrote.

I think at times the lack of violence at shows can be a good thing, however I'd hate to see replced with harmonious lethargy. Punk bands should be exciting and energetic, they should create a urge to be active.

I am glad to see someone mentioning the old NZ bands, because there is a big problem with people these days not bothering to get involved with our punk history. You can talk to people such as myself who got into this type of music only a decade ago or more, and then talk to people who got into it even more recently, and you will notice the lack of knowledge of older bands amongst the second group. I think it's a very sad thing, as both groups are currently the future of this type of music.

Yes, I agree the bands were more real then. But that doesn't mean that there aren't any good bands playing punk music. Perhaps we could recommend some that you may be interested in?
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Postby slaughter » Wed Jun 04, 2003 10:48 am

well ost, it appears you havent met me, or heard those two bands.
both utter bubblegum pop rock, they insert the word punk there somewhere.

actually you may have met me, sunday morning on cuba street i was talking with Adian and Pert. meh, who knows.
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Postby BETTYfuckingBOO » Wed Jun 04, 2003 12:11 pm

maybe the percieved lack of knowledge of bands gone by is because of the very nature of punk music, people want to feel that their passion is original and theres to own. The last thing maybe a teenager wants to do is take some old persons music seriously and even worse feel that their method of rebbellion is no different, and in some cases, a watered down version of what has already been.
Which leads into the old argument on weather "punk" is still a valid form of youth rebbellion and the rebellion has moved to another genre or even another medium altogether leaving punk as it stands today as nothing but another youth tribe serving no other purpose than providing identity and a sense of belonging.
Punk is by no means cutting edge any longer, or inventive, or rebelling against, even a percieved, social injustices.
It could be argued that the type of people that may have embraced "punk" 15-20 years ago, will today be embracing something completley different. If done right, it will appear to me as abhorrent and completley unrelatable, as it has nothing to do with me and i should be the brunt of their anger and contempt. Not rehashed metal riffs and tired leftist rhetoric.
Which isnt to say that there arnt good punk bands any more, it could just mean that they are now just run of the mill pub bands and part of the accepted mainstream
cos were one ciggarette away from being done
one ciggarette away
sure has been fun

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Postby The Ost » Wed Jun 04, 2003 12:22 pm

Slaughter wrote:well ost, it appears you havent met me, or heard those two bands.
both utter bubblegum pop rock, they insert the word punk there somewhere.

actually you may have met me, sunday morning on cuba street i was talking with Adian and Pert. meh, who knows.


Haha - hey bro, I wondered who you were.

No I have yet to hear All Left Out, although I have heard Pugface and Mum's Dollar a few times (only on CD's I must admit). I was more referring to your description of the two bands, which seemed to be as far from the percieved boundaries of "punk" as can be. "Bubblegum Pop Rock" on the other hand, I think is a great description.

ZE HAIRFUHRER wrote:Which isnt to say that there arnt good punk bands any more, it could just mean that they are now just run of the mill pub bands and part of the accepted mainstream


Well I always take Missing Teeth as a good example - it's about fun times, being angry at things that are wrong, it's a about a energetic release, it's about being yourself and not giving a shit what others may think. It's also about drinking - but at the same time, if people want to abstain, I don't see a problem with that.

Mistaken Identity are another example.
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Postby BETTYfuckingBOO » Wed Jun 04, 2003 12:31 pm

The 'Ost wrote:
Well I always take Missing Teeth as a good example - it's about fun times, being angry at things that are wrong, it's a about a energetic release, it's about being yourself and not giving a shit what others may think. It's also about drinking - but at the same time, if people want to abstain, I don't see a problem with that.

Mistaken Identity are another example.


hahaha, wot you mean like hello sailor and the dudes :D :wink:
cos were one ciggarette away from being done

one ciggarette away

sure has been fun

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Postby The Ost » Wed Jun 04, 2003 12:35 pm

I was meaning more like the Citizen Band, actually. 8)

Also, I should respond in seriousness for a sec - I do think you make an excellent point about kids wanting to be involved in something new,not someone else recycled ideals.

However, these are the same people that will quite happily listen to old music from overseas; Dead Kennedys, Ramones, Sex Pistols, Buzzcocks, Minor Threat, CRASS, Exploited, etc. I understand that the old local music is harder to get, I just think it would be nice if more people at least gave the old NZ stuff a listen, it might inspire them, who knows? 8)

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Re: Missing links

Postby mike » Wed Jun 04, 2003 2:01 pm

I dont think apart from FDV who werent that good really anyway that any punks now would even know who these bands are.[/quote]

this aint true although I admit there are not many Punks on this board that remember such bands there is a few.I was talking with Al from the Warners last Saturday in Kings Arms and the week before. I have a few of their records and have had for years as well as I remember reading about those bands in Fanzines like Anti System,One World,Submission etc or owning records by the bands you mentioned.Its true Punk has changed a bit but not all the young guys like Pop Punk.I was too young to go to those gigs like Golden Showers as they were in 81(?) I didnt get into punk until 84 but I know they contributed to Capitol Kaos the first record I ever bought, when I was 13 Im 31 now. Good to see someone from that Era on here.

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Postby THE OVERLORD » Wed Jun 04, 2003 4:23 pm

Yeah, i'm with Mike. But what would I know, i'm only 35.

I lived in Wgtn from 88 to 89 and there were a lot of great bands there.
Flesh D-vice still rock hard even without Gerald (RIP).

All I wanted to say was the Terrorways.

That is all.

Oh yeah, you can keep the violent past I had the misfortune of witnessing first hand. I also think that apart from the big Peace Punk explosion here in the 80's, that punk is way more political now.

All you have to do is read any number of good zines these days.

Scruffix

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Postby gremlin » Wed Jun 04, 2003 6:08 pm

for me maby : CARNYS

coz theyre fuckin awesomeeee live, and leave me feeling overwhelmed coz theyre so fukcin briliant. i went to the carnys first show! WOHowHOWHOHOWhOHWoHOWHoOooooooop i love the carnys so

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Postby Nickee » Wed Jun 04, 2003 6:56 pm

I didn't mean to diss FDV- they were a great live band- it's just that there were other ones around that didn't know how to generate the publicity i suppose- Number 9, Whazzo Ghoti, to name 2, Gerald (r.i.p) was a master of generating publicity- all i was saying that there was more to 80-'s punk than just F.D.V- especially in Wgtn. It was a good scene and without FDV carrying the flag things may not have been as good.

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Postby mike » Thu Jun 05, 2003 1:00 pm

Yeah thats all cool but you forgot to mention TAB I really liked their record I still do, just I havent played it for a bit.Things are certainly a bit different in Wellington thesedays and everywhere else but if it was the same it would be boring.I think personally right now these are some good times for Punk in NZ again.That is if you think of punk as including a few other styles of music under the same banner.Theres so much on like look at Ak last week at the Kings Arms,St James,Scorpio then the week before with Spelling Mistakes and the night after at Cafe 223.Im probably not including everything either.I think there needs to be a record or cd to document the 80's punk of NZ. Ive heard of a lot of bands but only really got to hear the bigger ones who released records.I remember a mate of mine going into Waikeria prison close to Hamilton) around(89-90) and he was saying Manson Family was written real big in the remand section at one stage,when you walk in he didnt know who they were and wasnt into that sort of music.I never heard them, but I heard of them, same as the Subdominants, who Id like to hear.

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Postby demongirl » Thu Jun 05, 2003 2:08 pm

aiight - here's 5 cents - 'The Rodents' 9 piece ska band - Wellington circa 1979 - the best NZ Punk band by far... without which my mum would never have fallen for the spunky guitarist and hence created me !!! Check the pedigree !!!

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Postby Nickee » Thu Jun 05, 2003 6:16 pm

The Rodents! I didn't equate them with punk but I suppose by todays standards they were! Neoteric Tribesman, L.I.F.E, B.R.F, Knives of West 11, Wallsockets, Ambitious Veges- they were the punks of the time- Then F.D.V and the rest- anyone remember the great F.D.V Helloween parties- they were good nights! I must go to a gig one day-I'll be the bald (not self induced these days) one in the wheelchair!

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Postby PertHJ » Thu Jun 05, 2003 7:15 pm

demongirl wrote:aiight - here's 5 cents - 'The Rodents' 9 piece ska band - Wellington circa 1979 - the best NZ Punk band by far... without which my mum would never have fallen for the spunky guitarist and hence created me !!! Check the pedigree !!!


oh wow thats awesome!!!

thats such a cool life story its got history, SKA!!, WELLINGTON!! and romance.

wix for you girl
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Postby phaedrus » Fri Jun 06, 2003 2:00 am

s.snow wrote:i went to the carnys first show!


I've been to a number of Carny's shows where it seemed like it was the first time they played...

p.s. which one was their first show?


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