Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Wank on about your rig and how grand it sounds or just ask for advice on gear.
xCaptainx
Stay Cold
Posts: 12163
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 4:36 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby xCaptainx » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:37 am

Sex offender? really?

Image

Now that you mention it...

User avatar
Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 9886
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: LFH

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:49 am

Obzen wrote:
Cosmo Kramer wrote:so, whats your case again? summerize? bullet points?


1. It's a tonal thing (cutting through a certain type of guitar sound)
2. Coins on bass head can have similar effect/sound
3. Electric guitar vs acoustic + live EQ, noisegates etc
4. The plaintiff is a known child sex offender



what those points are stupid?
Image
Kramer Murphy and Associates

Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:00 pm

Bullshit, they're legit as.
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

Nathanael
Posts: 1161
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 7:26 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Nathanael » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:52 pm

Obzen wrote:
Cosmo Kramer wrote:so, whats your case again? summerize? bullet points?


1. It's a tonal thing (cutting through a certain type of guitar sound)
2. Coins on bass head can have similar effect/sound
3. Electric guitar vs acoustic + live EQ, noisegates etc
4. The plaintiff is a known child sex offender


What on earth does this have to do with anything? Every sound you make on stage is possibly gonna get some EQ. Tonal thing? Chuck a B91 in a kick drum and I can make it click just like a trigger, then I could limit the fuck out of it so your pussy taps come through as big kicks with no dynamics.

The point on this side is that music should be made naturally and without the help of dodgy sounding sampled kicks, same as the other argument that sample snares and toms in recording are piss weak and you should just play your kit like Thor instead of relying on modern day work arounds.
General Mutante wrote:Every wristie is a performance as far as I'm concerned.


Image

Nathanael
Posts: 1161
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 7:26 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Nathanael » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:52 pm

double post.
Last edited by Nathanael on Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
General Mutante wrote:Every wristie is a performance as far as I'm concerned.


Image

User avatar
Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 9886
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: LFH

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:56 pm

Yeah shove that up your arse Team Ross
Image
Kramer Murphy and Associates

xCaptainx
Stay Cold
Posts: 12163
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 4:36 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby xCaptainx » Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:15 pm

hahah Cav, Nat didnt address my point at all.

But try find a drummer who could create a beater distance of over 2" while doing 16th notes @ 250bpm. Remember, I'm talking about a veryspecific genre of music where kicks are anywhere from 220 to 260bpm 16th notes, and where triggers are understandable and work well. Often it's not physically possible for a drummer to maintain that speed, at the velocity required for a mic'd accoustic drum to sound halfway decent, for a long period of time.


Nats solution to use a B91 kick drum and limit it.

Perhaps the drummer would rather use a sample they are confident with, relying less on soundguys eq'ing the crap out of their kick every night. Especially if they rely on in house guys who don't know, or particularly care about the tone/style/genre? Who can afford to take their own sound guy on tour everywhere in NZ/Aus?

Demanding a modern metal drummer to maintain a 250bpm'ish double kick at 'Thor' velocity levels is moronic. Stick to the mixing desk Nat.

User avatar
toothbrush
Posts: 6996
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 5:17 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby toothbrush » Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:44 pm

Image

User avatar
Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 9886
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: LFH

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:54 pm

toothbrush wrote:Image



^^ lol
Image
Kramer Murphy and Associates

Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:56 pm

Nathanael wrote: Chuck a B91 in a kick drum and I can make it click just like a trigger, then I could limit the fuck out of it so your pussy taps come through as big kicks with no dynamics.


Not sure what point you're making here, do you deem this method more honorable than using a trigger? The input (drummer talent, technique) is the same, the output (massive consistent clicky kick sound) is the same, but because it's EQ-ing techniques rather than a trigger and sample that makes it natural?

Nathanael wrote:The point on this side is that music should be made naturally


Are guitar effects pedals and noisegates 'natural'? Unless you only approve of unamplified acoustic music with no electricity involved isn't this statement hypocritical? I'd like to know exactly where you draw the line between natural and un-natural.

It sounds like I'm way more disgruntled here than I actually am. I just find debating shit way more fun than work.
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:58 pm

Cosmo Kramer wrote:Yeah shove that up your arse Team Ross


Why 'Team Ross'? This is MY thread about MY triggers. :x
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

xCaptainx
Stay Cold
Posts: 12163
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 4:36 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby xCaptainx » Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:58 pm

Obzen wrote:It sounds like I'm way more disgruntled here than I actually am. I just find debating way more fun than work.


Only reason I've been posting more lately, haha. Taking a queue from Cav :baton:

User avatar
Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 9886
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: LFH

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:24 pm

xCaptainx wrote:
Obzen wrote:It sounds like I'm way more disgruntled here than I actually am. I just find debating way more fun than work.


Only reason I've been posting more lately, haha. Taking a queue from Cav :baton:


oh look at you two now back tracking....
Image
Kramer Murphy and Associates

xCaptainx
Stay Cold
Posts: 12163
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 4:36 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby xCaptainx » Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:25 pm

hey I'm still right. Not back tracking that, no matter how many batons you swing my way.

Nathanael
Posts: 1161
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 7:26 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Nathanael » Thu Feb 16, 2012 3:08 pm

I just view triggers as lazy, no matter how you try and sell it. Do away with your kick drum completely if thats what you want to do, instead of getting all poser on it like that dude who played for Forced To Submit with his kick drum sticking out like dogs balls so he could fit his trigger pad in.
Yes I think using EQ and compression is more noble than a trigger. It is (generally) keeping everything in the analogue domain which is my main issue here. Again with gates etc... I hate gates on guitars. I hate digital effects on guitars. This is talking about agressive music here. Yes they have their place, but in my preference for heavy music I would rather hear the intensity of the performance.
As has been pointed out earlier, If you have to play 32th at 1000bpm then either practise the fuck out of it or do away with your real drums and be honest about it.

Ross, quite often as an engineer when I have had to mix in some plebs triggers it has been woeful. What the drummer thinks sounds great at practise hardly ever translates into the mix. You end up with something with too much top end and its tuned so low that the bass is drowning the kick. All you end up hearing is slap and click, not body at all.

Being that you know so much about Sound Reinforcement Ross it should be rather easy for you to go up to any sound guy and give him a quick run down of what you want things to sound like.

I play in a band that uses MPCs for drums, as well as a kit. I have a synth pedal on my bass the majority of the set. We use a Heil Sound Talkbox for the vocals (ala Zapp and Roger). But we are not playing genre music. It is a completely different aesthetic. So yes I see where you guys are coming from that it suits your aesthetic. I just think that side of it is wack in metal.
General Mutante wrote:Every wristie is a performance as far as I'm concerned.


Image

User avatar
Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 9886
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: LFH

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Thu Feb 16, 2012 3:22 pm

Team Everyone Else just won !!!

:lilangel: :bday: :baton:

and the crowd goes wild !!!

Image
Image
Kramer Murphy and Associates

Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Thu Feb 16, 2012 4:48 pm

Image

You haven't heard the last from me
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

User avatar
Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 9886
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: LFH

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Thu Feb 16, 2012 4:51 pm

lol im sure we havent,,.,... im sure "Team Ross" will bring the subject up again in another thread....
Image
Kramer Murphy and Associates

User avatar
Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 9886
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: LFH

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:44 pm

hey we still arguing here?>
Image
Kramer Murphy and Associates

Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Fri Feb 17, 2012 1:43 pm

Well, I was considering arguing that you're a totally biased judge and didn't sum up or explain the reasoning for your verdict. I personally felt I won, as the others were unable to (or chose not to?)rebutt my main arguments which I thought were totally kick-ass.

But I'd also like to thank the plantiff for the gear advice at the start of the thread. I'm pretty excited about getting the Focusrite Saffire Pro 14.
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

User avatar
Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 9886
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: LFH

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Fri Feb 17, 2012 1:58 pm

Obzen wrote:Well, I was considering arguing that you're a totally biased judge and didn't sum up or explain the reasoning for your verdict. I personally felt I won, as the others were unable to (or chose not to?)rebutt my main arguments which I thought were totally kick-ass.

But I'd also like to thank the plantiff for the gear advice at the start of the thread. I'm pretty excited about getting the Focusrite Saffire Pro 14.



i think they are probaberly over repeating themseleves over and over again to Team Ross
Image
Kramer Murphy and Associates

Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Fri Feb 17, 2012 2:33 pm

Cop out
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

User avatar
Dick Dynamite
Posts: 9843
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2004 5:13 pm
Location: London
Contact:

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Dick Dynamite » Fri Feb 17, 2012 2:37 pm

You know you can program midi with any of a bazillion free pieces of software eh? Why would you want to record a live performance, only to replace it with samples that you'll probably put in time after the fact anyway?

User avatar
Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 9886
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: LFH

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Fri Feb 17, 2012 2:41 pm

Dick Dynamite wrote:You know you can program midi with any of a bazillion free pieces of software eh? Why would you want to record a live performance, only to replace it with samples that you'll probably put in time after the fact anyway?



well, yeah, i guess thats why bands arnt even recording with a drummer for their album (see SG's new cd - apprently done like this)

dont quote me on that.

and i can already tell you whats gonna be argued about

Ross: oh but you save money and blah blah blah monster energy drink blah blah blah



:baton:


i dunno. time and place. and the place is gay
Image
Kramer Murphy and Associates

User avatar
Dick Dynamite
Posts: 9843
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2004 5:13 pm
Location: London
Contact:

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Dick Dynamite » Fri Feb 17, 2012 3:06 pm

Well I was thinking just program all your kick first and then just play along to it live with the rest of the kit.


Guess a few people have kinda already suggested that.

xCaptainx
Stay Cold
Posts: 12163
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 4:36 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby xCaptainx » Fri Feb 17, 2012 3:08 pm

Nathanael wrote:So yes I see where you guys are coming from that it suits your aesthetic. I just think that side of it is wack in metal.


That sums it up well. Nat and I fundamentally agree across most points, the only aspect of his opinion I disagreed with is the reality of playing tech death double kicks at an audible volume at high tempos. But as I said earlier, it's a matter of taste. Nat doesn't like that aspect of metal. I do. I wouldnt like Nats preferred rig, Nat wouldnt like mine.

I'm moving to a full D.I right later in the year, so yes no doubt I'll have much more dealings with soundguys in the near future, haha.

We're at a point where we might as well argue what is better, chocolate or vanilla ice cream. Cant really 'win' there now can you? Cav, what's your preference? Neapolitan? You get to have both sides :baton: plus pink :baton:

xCaptainx
Stay Cold
Posts: 12163
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 4:36 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby xCaptainx » Fri Feb 17, 2012 3:09 pm

Image
Or are you a yoghurt man?

Nathanael
Posts: 1161
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 7:26 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Nathanael » Fri Feb 17, 2012 3:14 pm

Well we can argue because a mic in front of moving air will always sound better than a D.I.
General Mutante wrote:Every wristie is a performance as far as I'm concerned.


Image

User avatar
Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 9886
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: LFH

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Fri Feb 17, 2012 3:15 pm

xCaptainx wrote:
Nathanael wrote:So yes I see where you guys are coming from that it suits your aesthetic. I just think that side of it is wack in metal.


That sums it up well. Nat and I fundamentally agree across most points, the only aspect of his opinion I disagreed with is the reality of playing tech death double kicks at an audible volume at high tempos. But as I said earlier, it's a matter of taste. Nat doesn't like that aspect of metal. I do. I wouldnt like Nats preferred rig, Nat wouldnt like mine.

I'm moving to a full D.I right later in the year, so yes no doubt I'll have much more dealings with soundguys in the near future, haha.

We're at a point where we might as well argue what is better, chocolate or vanilla ice cream. Cant really 'win' there now can you? Cav, what's your preference? Neapolitan? You get to have both sides :baton: plus pink :baton:


lol


whats a full D ??

no its not like chocolate or vanilia

its like icecream (og) or gelato (towny gay)
Image
Kramer Murphy and Associates

xCaptainx
Stay Cold
Posts: 12163
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 4:36 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby xCaptainx » Fri Feb 17, 2012 3:18 pm

sorry meant to write full D.I rig. Getting a line 6 L3T powered monitor when they arrive in the country, depending on the price.

Haha yeah that's a better analogy. I'll have a cup of towny gay ice cream please :lol:


Return to “Gear Wank”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest