Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Wank on about your rig and how grand it sounds or just ask for advice on gear.
Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Mon Feb 13, 2012 7:19 pm

Hello,

I'm running a pretty cheap and simple setup for my fully mic'd drum recording. I'm about to buy a (hopefully cheap) audio interface. I'm currently only recording using the stereo mix direct from the mixer into line-in. This only leaves me with 2 channels of separation (i.e. left and right, which I separate and turn into mono).

I use a kick drum trigger and module, I usually have that feeding into the mixer, but I've decided I should give myself a third separate channel by having my triggered kick drum feed in as midi signal instead of as part of the mix.

I need to buy a midi interface, since I already plan to buy an audio interface I was thinking I could just buy one interface that will deal with both the stereo mix and the midi signal, am I correct in thinking this?

My gear
1. Behringer mixer (with no usb, midi or any kind of digital output)
2. Drum mics
3. A Yamaha DTXpress electronic drumkit module (with midi output)
4. A kick drum trigger
5. An iBook G4 running Cubase SX

Here is the interface I'm looking at buying, will this work how I want it to? M-Audio Fast Track Pro - RubberMonkey.co.nz New Zealand
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

User avatar
kettles
Posts: 888
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 9:13 pm
Location: Brighton UK
Contact:

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby kettles » Mon Feb 13, 2012 10:36 pm

I used to own one of them. It would occasionally lag out pretty hardcore and need resetting. Those things are pretty old now too, they run on USB 1.1, not USB 2, so while it'll do the job it's hardly high performance. IMO you should just save a bit more and get something with four mic ins and running USB2 or Firewire. Fucking around with MIDI is going to be a real pain in the ass. But I guess you could run the trigger in as well as a mic so you have it there. Setting up, tuning, playing, recording and mixing drums all on your own is hard work even to get acceptable results so having stable gear is going to make things so much easier.

Pretty sure it'll do audio and MIDI at the same time anyway.

Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Mon Feb 13, 2012 10:58 pm

Cheers for the tip man,

Turns out my old iBook only has usb 1.1 anyway, so I guess I should really get something with firewire:

Will this work?: http://www.rubbermonkey.co.nz/Music-Pro ... udioFire-2

Another thing someone said to me is "Only thing I would make sure is if the drivers still support the Power PC chip that your G4 is running. Those poor things are getting on in life and more companies are dropping support." - Trying to find out about that with this Audiofire thing
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

User avatar
kettles
Posts: 888
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 9:13 pm
Location: Brighton UK
Contact:

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby kettles » Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:33 pm

Probably, but for how much it is you'd be better saving for something with more functionality don't ya reckon? It only has two line ins, no mic preamps, I know with what you're intending to do you wouldn't need them, but if you ever want to use a portable/simpler setup then having built in pres would be handy, or you'll have to cart your mixer everywhere. And its fucking expensive. You should be looking at something like this - http://www.rockshop.co.nz/shop/recording/focusrite-saffire-pro-14-8-in-6-out-firewire-audio-interface-w-xcite-bundle-authorized-reseller.html

Or even better - http://www.rockshop.co.nz/shop/recording/focusrite-saffire-pro-40-20-in-20-out-firewire-audio-interface-w-xcite-bundle-authorized-reseller.html. This would let you run 8 mics, plus more if you used your mixer, AND midi. I owned the next model up from this (Saffire 56) and it was great to use.

Hopefully the other people who know way more about recording will speak up. I don't really know a whole lot about what gear is out there. I don't know anything about macs either.

What are you trying to do with these drum recordings? Just curious. I got decent quality with just two mics going thru my Fast Track Pro with an SM57 in the kick and another SM57 overhead. If I had a good condenser and an actual kick mic it would have been even better.

Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:34 am

Sweet, that shit is awesome. Seems better than what I've been looking at previously, and that first one is totally within my price range. I'll just have to make sure there won't be any compatibility issues since my mac is pretty old.

I'm wanting to record drums for an ep/album with this. Only just started to take the idea of doing it (i.e. an official release) myself seriously. Recently I've been stoked as hell with the sound I'm getting from line-out from a cheap mixer into the line-in of my netbook. So I figure I'd be even heller more stoked with it if I had another separated channel to work with, especially if it's a totally customizable midi kick-drum.
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

Nathanael
Posts: 1161
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 7:26 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Nathanael » Tue Feb 14, 2012 1:50 pm

I'll jump in to say that the Focusrite range is pretty solid. I own the LS56 and have been really happy with it. Good clean mic pres, plenty of gain, the routing is great and I'm also using it as a midi interface with no issues what so ever.
Im not sure about compatibility issues with an older mac, but it seems the Focusrite gear works better with Mac over PC. Many threads out there from grumpy PC owners having troubles with firewire but no issues with Mac.
General Mutante wrote:Every wristie is a performance as far as I'm concerned.


Image

User avatar
dclxvi
Posts: 13562
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 5:50 pm
Location: pissy shitty bloddy period rape shit cum food stains

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby dclxvi » Tue Feb 14, 2012 3:30 pm

Hey guys why don't you try out the new Line 6 HD500? Also maybe you could consider a new B.C Rich Warlock, and in case you get thirsty during your recording session you should by some Monster Energy drinks to keep you refreshed and energised!
Kerry wrote:Then at an old age, the neighbour's dog thought it would be crakup to maul him and he died so we chucked him up in the ground.


Cosmo Kramer wrote:i have full qualifications (john grisham novels 1-10) and i am yet to sit the bar exam but i know i will pass

User avatar
dclxvi
Posts: 13562
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 5:50 pm
Location: pissy shitty bloddy period rape shit cum food stains

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby dclxvi » Tue Feb 14, 2012 3:30 pm

Hey guys why don't you try out the new Line 6 HD500? Also maybe you could consider a new B.C Rich Warlock, and in case you get thirsty during your recording session you should by some Monster Energy drinks to keep you refreshed and energised!
Kerry wrote:Then at an old age, the neighbour's dog thought it would be crakup to maul him and he died so we chucked him up in the ground.


Cosmo Kramer wrote:i have full qualifications (john grisham novels 1-10) and i am yet to sit the bar exam but i know i will pass

User avatar
Dick Dynamite
Posts: 9843
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2004 5:13 pm
Location: London
Contact:

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Dick Dynamite » Tue Feb 14, 2012 3:32 pm

I'm surprised it took so long.

xCaptainx
Stay Cold
Posts: 12157
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 4:36 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby xCaptainx » Tue Feb 14, 2012 3:33 pm

I know absolutely nothing about recording drums but that sounds like a great idea! Thanks for the suggestion!

User avatar
dclxvi
Posts: 13562
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 5:50 pm
Location: pissy shitty bloddy period rape shit cum food stains

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby dclxvi » Tue Feb 14, 2012 3:44 pm

:baton: :baton: :baton: :baton: :baton: :baton: :baton: :baton: :baton:
Kerry wrote:Then at an old age, the neighbour's dog thought it would be crakup to maul him and he died so we chucked him up in the ground.


Cosmo Kramer wrote:i have full qualifications (john grisham novels 1-10) and i am yet to sit the bar exam but i know i will pass

xCaptainx
Stay Cold
Posts: 12157
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 4:36 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby xCaptainx » Tue Feb 14, 2012 3:54 pm

:baton:Image :baton:

Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Tue Feb 14, 2012 4:21 pm

Aww man, my serious threads always get derailed.. speaking of which, where the hell is Cosmo? I haven't seen a single post from him today, I'm kinda worried, anyone heard from him/her?
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Tue Feb 14, 2012 4:23 pm

Nathanael wrote:I'll jump in to say that the Focusrite range is pretty solid. I own the LS56 and have been really happy with it. Good clean mic pres, plenty of gain, the routing is great and I'm also using it as a midi interface with no issues what so ever.


Sounds promising. I might email focusrite to query compatibility to save me from having to trawl through endless specs info and probably miss something crucial and fux it all up.
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

Nathanael
Posts: 1161
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 7:26 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Nathanael » Tue Feb 14, 2012 4:52 pm

It can be a punishing website, but this dude http://www.gearslutz.com/board/members/120875-chris-focusrite/ will sort you out.
General Mutante wrote:Every wristie is a performance as far as I'm concerned.


Image

User avatar
dclxvi
Posts: 13562
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 5:50 pm
Location: pissy shitty bloddy period rape shit cum food stains

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby dclxvi » Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:55 pm

xCaptainx wrote::baton:Image :baton:


pfffffft as if. what fuckin stone-age dicks use actual drums these days!? get real!
Kerry wrote:Then at an old age, the neighbour's dog thought it would be crakup to maul him and he died so we chucked him up in the ground.


Cosmo Kramer wrote:i have full qualifications (john grisham novels 1-10) and i am yet to sit the bar exam but i know i will pass

User avatar
kettles
Posts: 888
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 9:13 pm
Location: Brighton UK
Contact:

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby kettles » Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:55 pm

Pork Pie make great drums, but I prefer black V so I'd get it repainted to suit.

User avatar
yossarian
Posts: 4648
Joined: Thu Sep 09, 2004 11:49 am
Location: I'VE SAID MY BEEF

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby yossarian » Wed Feb 15, 2012 8:14 am

Obzen wrote:Aww man, my serious threads always get derailed.. speaking of which, where the hell is Cosmo? I haven't seen a single post from him today, I'm kinda worried, anyone heard from him/her?


I finally snapped and now he's feeding the fish in Oriental Bay.

Pretty much get anything around the $600-$800 mark-Focusrite, Presonus etc, the brand in all seriousness doesn't matter too much because the firewire cards and mic pres all come from the same respective factories in the People's Republic, just avoid the lower end shit like Behringer and Phonic because the difference in price is mostly quality control. You might luck out, but you'll probably be fucked.

Whatever you do, get something with 3 mic pres and phantom power.

Then by 3 large diaphragm condensor mics, of reasonable parentage.

Then learn the correct use of the "Glyn Johns triangle"

You will now make boss as fuck drum recordings that sound like drums.

Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Wed Feb 15, 2012 9:06 am

yossarian wrote: Pretty much get anything around the $600-$800

noooooooooooooo :oops: too spensive.

yossarian wrote:Whatever you do, get something with 3 mic pres and phantom power.

Then by 3 large diaphragm condensor mics, of reasonable parentage.

Then learn the correct use of the "Glyn Johns triangle"

You will now make boss as fuck drum recordings that sound like drums.


This sounds like not what I want to do. Are you saying just use three condenser mics and that's it?

I recks you're tryna send me up the garden path, and that this idea won't suit what I'm trying to do.
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

Nathanael
Posts: 1161
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 7:26 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Nathanael » Wed Feb 15, 2012 9:52 am

I think Shane is actually trying to send you up the proper recording path.

One of the best drum recordings I've made was a kick, hihat, and mono overhead (pointing over the drummers shoulder) Then send all channels to a bus for parallel compression (no compression on the individual channels) then a second bus for reverb just getting HH and OH. Simple and no fuss, no going crazy with phase, and the drummer aint surrounded by stands and mics.

Triggers can go eat it.
General Mutante wrote:Every wristie is a performance as far as I'm concerned.


Image

Obzen
Posts: 306
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:06 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Obzen » Wed Feb 15, 2012 10:05 am

Nathanael wrote:I think Shane is actually trying to send you up the proper recording path.

One of the best drum recordings I've made was a kick, hihat, and mono overhead (pointing over the drummers shoulder) Then send all channels to a bus for parallel compression (no compression on the individual channels) then a second bus for reverb just getting HH and OH. Simple and no fuss, no going crazy with phase, and the drummer aint surrounded by stands and mics.

Triggers can go eat it.


I don't have enough experience to argue with any of that. I'll keep it all in mind, but for now I'll stick to what I'm trying to do.

Triggers cannot go eat it. Along with disliking triggers I suspect you probably dislike the kinds of music genres that commonly use them and the type of music I'm recording drums for.

I had resisted triggers for years, but recently got a kick trigger and am loving how it's working out.
Image
Well seymour, you are an odd fellow, but I must say, you steam a good ham

Nathanael
Posts: 1161
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2009 7:26 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Nathanael » Wed Feb 15, 2012 10:11 am

No you are wrong. Triggers make me dislike a band, not a genre. The bands not using triggers in genres that are awash with them stand out more because of the natural sound and feel.
General Mutante wrote:Every wristie is a performance as far as I'm concerned.


Image

User avatar
kettles
Posts: 888
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 9:13 pm
Location: Brighton UK
Contact:

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby kettles » Wed Feb 15, 2012 10:46 am

I can't stand the triggered sound either, but I understand why you'd want to do it in your case. If you really can't afford much, the FTP or similar probably is your best option. But don't buy a new one man, they're on trade me all the time, I sold mine for like $200.

Micing with minimal mics can sound fantastic, John Bonham did it.

User avatar
kettles
Posts: 888
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 9:13 pm
Location: Brighton UK
Contact:

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby kettles » Wed Feb 15, 2012 10:47 am

Nathanael wrote:No you are wrong. Triggers make me dislike a band, not a genre. The bands not using triggers in genres that are awash with them stand out more because of the natural sound and feel.



Like who? Just curious to hear some modern heavy shit with natural drum sounds.

xCaptainx
Stay Cold
Posts: 12157
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 4:36 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby xCaptainx » Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:11 am

Of course if you're not going for a natural feel (lets face it, whats natural about a 250-280bpm blast beat in tech death? or most metal in general) Triggers are great.

That being said, they do sound pretty stupid if you're doing a rock band, or going for some other style of production.

User avatar
ghetto ninja
Posts: 11424
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:13 pm
Location: Knee deep in a suburban nightmare

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby ghetto ninja » Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:17 am

xCaptainx wrote:(lets face it, whats natural about a 250-280bpm blast beat in tech death? or most metal in general)

Triggered blasts are not Satans. Please observe Cam from Diocletian as to how a truly Satans blast goes, or Simon Frost, or Lance Downing. See I didnt even need to use overseas examples.
Martyrdamn wrote:Said 'hey baby gurl' to about seven girls tonight,
turns out girls don't like guys talking about getting up in their guts,
fagets, right.

xCaptainx
Stay Cold
Posts: 12157
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 4:36 pm

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby xCaptainx » Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:28 am

Not disputing that at all, they are all great drummers. Triggers are a personal choice. Our MTE drummer plays in Dawn of Azazel and his triggered kicks sound great, especially at the speeds he plays. I don't think he's going for the 'sound/feel' that Nat is referring to.

Corey never uses triggers for Mark of Man/IDR too and his kit sound great also, he makes a point of going for that natural sound/feel.

Just pointing out it's personal preference really, based on what you're going for.

User avatar
Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 9886
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: LFH

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Wed Feb 15, 2012 12:17 pm

dclxvi wrote:Hey guys why don't you try out the new Line 6 HD500? Also maybe you could consider a new B.C Rich Warlock, and in case you get thirsty during your recording session you should by some Monster Energy drinks to keep you refreshed and energised!



:baton:
Image
Kramer Murphy and Associates

User avatar
dclxvi
Posts: 13562
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 5:50 pm
Location: pissy shitty bloddy period rape shit cum food stains

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby dclxvi » Wed Feb 15, 2012 1:27 pm

xCaptainx wrote:Our MTE drummer plays in Dawn of Azazel and his triggered kicks sound great


Image
Kerry wrote:Then at an old age, the neighbour's dog thought it would be crakup to maul him and he died so we chucked him up in the ground.


Cosmo Kramer wrote:i have full qualifications (john grisham novels 1-10) and i am yet to sit the bar exam but i know i will pass

User avatar
Cosmo Kramer
Posts: 9886
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:27 pm
Location: LFH

Re: Recording drums Midi-digital interface

Postby Cosmo Kramer » Wed Feb 15, 2012 1:58 pm

i have nothing left to say but

:baton:
Image
Kramer Murphy and Associates


Return to “Gear Wank”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest